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Post by yashica1943 on Feb 9, 2016 4:32:09 GMT -5
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 9, 2016 7:27:38 GMT -5
I must admit to pure speculation, based on the body, is a rangefinder made by Rectaflex in Italy, dismissing the Wollensak lens as evidence of a US origin.
It looks distinctly Italian in design, the body, knobs and layout details all look right, not German. The rangefinder looks American, but the design was copied.
In the period after the war there were several makers in Italy that tried to enter the market with little success, to expensive, or just unusual designs.
The use of the American lens indicates it was intended for sale in the States, but it's body looks far more advanced than most US designs of the period.
I think Japanese can be dismissed, they simply copied Leica. On the face of it, the camera is very rare indeed, but would require more research.
Stephen
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 9, 2016 8:15:00 GMT -5
The camera is a mystery, I know many obscure makes, odd Japanese, rare Italian, but this has me foxed. It has no name, and this indicates the maker was on the losing side of the war. US makers usually marked clearly, as do most others, unless a prototype.
Some made in ex axis countries were plain, to allow a distributors name to be added to cover origins. Most Italian are clearly marked, as they mainly sold to the States.
The camera is very well specified, D/A PC, and remote release on front, FP shutter, rangefinder, I assume coupled.
There were few countries making 35mm outside Germany, US, France, Russia, Japan, and Italy, and the Wollensak lens gives no clues as they supplied to several makers, or it could be a replacement lens.
It all comes back to an Italian connection, with American influence.
There must be somebody here who has ideas or direct knowledge. Stephen.
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 9, 2016 9:06:46 GMT -5
Just had a non member opinion, It is a body focus model, the knob on the front is not low speeds, but focus, and this swings the design to the states, along with the use of alloy for the knobs. The odds in my opinion are low, but it could have been made as a prototype by Kodak or Ansco. Perhaps made say in Italy etc., to an American Specification. This does not explain why it is in Japan now. No American design I have seen looks like it, but the various bits of the details are US inspired, like the rangefinder, counter, and the body focus via knob. All the Leica clones and relatives I can find simply do not match the camera. Anyway I am interested but only if it remains lower in the price league,
Stephen.
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SidW
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Post by SidW on Feb 9, 2016 19:39:49 GMT -5
I zoomed all over it. On the shutter setting dial, it has P rather than B. Does that stir a linguistic memory among members?Stephen,
How about P for Pause? or Pyrotechnics? or Powder? or Press? or Push? Mickey ?How did this happen??
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 9, 2016 20:32:31 GMT -5
That's the problem, it has got bits from everybody! It looks like a full production camera bar the aluminium knobs, but others used them.
The focus knob on the body and no helical focusing in the lens is very Argus. It could just be a home brew, but the top casing is so complex to make.
Bolsey, who did the cameras designed and made under his name, did do other designs, but I have never seen this one. It's in Japan, so was any maker doing this sort of quality outside the group who made Leica clones?
To my mind it looks like a well designed camera, aimed at high end use, it certainly has all the features built in any quality camera should have
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 9, 2016 20:53:12 GMT -5
The P instead of B may be a clue but it is obscure, as Bulb does not translate to any word beginning with P on Google.
The speed range goes to 1/1000th again indicating an expensive camera.
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mickeyobe
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Post by mickeyobe on Feb 10, 2016 1:00:12 GMT -5
On the shutter setting dial, it has P rather than B. Does that stir a linguistic memory among members?
Stephen,
How about P for Pause?
or
Pyrotechnics?
or
Powder?
or
Press?
or
Push?
Mickey[/quote]
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Post by yashica1943 on Feb 10, 2016 6:43:30 GMT -5
Thanks for all the input. I am quite pleased that I found something rare that has Puzzled the members.
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 10, 2016 6:49:24 GMT -5
But all english or most others even the Russians use B I have tried searches for makers in the States, Italy, France, Germany, Austria, Lichtenstein, Hungary, Japan, In Google and Google Images. It is definitely not the UK, I know all the 35mm models ever made.
I am thinking now that it is a prototype, made in Japan.......weird it has no mentions in pictures, but maybe it is an early post war product that was never developed. It is very obviously meant for the US market.
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Post by yashica1943 on Feb 10, 2016 6:56:07 GMT -5
Perhaps the 'P' stands for Poco Tempo in Italian or Poco Tiempo in Spanish. (Short time).
What i notice is that there is not a cross head screw in sight! Is that typical of a prototype camera. Almost looks like some parts were made in a shed or small workshop, but that complicated top cover casting or moulding is a worry!
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 10, 2016 7:04:23 GMT -5
Just had a call about the camera, non member, in the repair trade, he thinks it might be from Germany, Adox or Agfa, who tried many prototypes before resuming production of other ranges.
The lens may have been altered to fit, and obviously with German lens production at zero, they may have used the lens from America.
Two German designers did make prototypes at the time, the two that later designed the Witness for Ilford. They were ex Leica designers and went freelance to Adox at first, and later Agfa, moving to England when Agfa resumed production.
The Witness does share some of the spec of this camera, including the breech, although it was split on the Witness to take screw as well.
I am not saying it is a Witness prototype, just that it might have a connection, due to the extensive specification of the camera. It would place the camera as made in Germany.
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 10, 2016 7:08:10 GMT -5
Perhaps the 'P' stands for Poco Tempo in Italian or Poco Tiempo in Spanish. (Short time). What i notice is that there is not a cross head screw in sight! Is that typical of a prototype camera. Almost looks like some parts were made in a shed or small workshop, but that complicated top cover casting or moulding is a worry! Cross heads were unusual in the 1940's, and it does have screws everywhere, on the bottom, front etc., in places they need them, but with no thoughts as to appearance. There were Spanish makers, but not to this type of design
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Post by yashica1943 on Feb 10, 2016 8:37:04 GMT -5
Could the split rangefinder arrangement have been borrowed from an Agfa Karat? That is what it reminded me of..
Also the 'Poco Tempo' is Italian, Bencini made some odd looking 35mm cameras.
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Stephen
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Post by Stephen on Feb 10, 2016 12:58:07 GMT -5
There are several good sites on Leica copies and nobody mentions Bencini as ever making a 35mm leica clone camera, and indeed, the Afga Karat 35mm did come to mind.
The rangefinder may be uncoupled as the small knob appears to give a window with a number, which could be transfered to the lens. Perhaps coupled like the Contax.
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