Zeiss Ikon Ikonta 520

[Peltigera]

Hanz, no handle on the 515 but I did find it stamped into the leatherette - actually, I have already given this number to you last year:

Nettar 515 F34951 lens:Novar, shutter: Klio 238.19

[hansz]

Tnx, peltigera, and sorry for looking twice...
Until now, my numbers were just inside big spreadsheet files, no chance to crosscorrelate.

A month ago I started to put it all into a MySQL DB and now I can check the numbers (and found a lot wrong postings..:-( Still have to find a way to publish them nicely.

Hans

[Berndt]

I finally had the chance to take a first test roll with this camera ( Zeiss Ikon Ikonta 520 ) and I am surprised and pleased with the results. Here one of the pictures, showing just me, because I prefer, not posting pictures of other people in public if avoidable.


Zeiss Ikon Ikonta 520 by bokuwanihongasuki, on Flickr

Inserted was an a little bit expired Fuji Provia 100F. I think, this picture looks pretty good and not "vintage" at all - as somebody ( or me ? ) would have expected from a prewar camera out of a junk box. The picture also shows, why I prefer medium format cameras. Such a depth of field on a full body shot would have required a much larger distance to the object if using a lens with the same focal length on a smaller format camera ... but that isn't possible nearly anywhere in a narrow city like Tokyo.

[hansz]

Same reason why I love 6x9cm with the 10,5cm lenses! The 520 has a 7,5cm lens (Tessar?) and should be capable of fine pictures.
Thanks for saving it from oblivion!

And a nice suit...:-)

hans

[Berndt]

And a nice suit...:-)

Hahaha ... thank you The uniform in Tokyo ... although my shoes do not really fit

BTW, Hans ... sometimes I think, all vintage german cameras are in Japan. Amazing, if you look at the 2nd hand camera shops.

[Stephen]

You should have had a coke in the hand, and gone for sponsorship.......

[nikonbob]

I hope Bernt doesn't mind me piling into his thread too but his posting got me thinking of an Ikonta 521/16 I have that is a bit of a puzzle. So here is the puzzle for Hansz, the camera body has 521/16 embossed on the leather covering and a serial number of E893XX and a presentation plate attached to the back dated 17 September 1939. It was presented to an employee of a paper mill I worked at in Canada. Canada declared war on Germany 10 Sept 1939. I had been given to understand that the Ikonta 532/16 was a post war camera.

The lens is a Novar 75/4.5 (no serial number that I can find) in a Klio shutter 1 to 125 with B. So, is the 521/16 a post war camera or not? Yes, it does take photos very well.

Bob

[hansz]

Bob, the Bestellnummer 521/16 was originally given to the Ikonta line in 1938. After the war the same number was given to the Ikonta I camera which was produced from 1948 to 1956. So basically the answer to your question is both pre- and postwar...
Can you tell me the exact bodynumber (Fabrikationsnummer) and the exact wording of the lens information (the Novar-Anastigmat doesn't have a serial number)?

Hans

[nikonbob]

Hans

Thank you for the clarification on the pre and post war bit. Seems to be some misinformation out there on the net on that, but it is the net after all. The exact camera serial number is E89314 and the Novar Anastigmat has no serial number that I can find.

Bob

[hansz]

Bob,

For Zeiss Ikon (as many other brands) there is a rule of thumb considering pre- and postwarII:
the prewar focal distance is measured in cm, and the postwar version is measured in mm.

But, as every rule-of-thumb, there are exceptions, especially close after the war, when parts of prewar stock were used, or old habits prevailed in the newly established production plants.
Within the Zeiss Ikon community there is a strong opinion that the bodynumbers of the postwar cameras, produced with prewar parts, are followed by an asterisk. You will see this often with the letter P and O disignated bodies.

Hans

[nikonbob]

Hans

Well, here is another puzzle then, the distance scale on the Novar lens is in "feet". Pre war export model, perhaps? Also the presentation plaque attached to the back of the camera is dated 17 Sept 1939. I am assuming, and maybe I should not, that this is the camera presented on that date. I can find no asterick after the serial number or the letters O or P on the body anywhere.

Bob

Sorry Hans, just realized I had a brain fade and you meant the focal length of the Novar not the distance scale on it. The Novar is marked as a 7,5 cm.

Bob

[hansz]

Hi Bob,

You are right, if the distance scale is in feet , it is an export model, well, to the non-metric countries... Here in The Netherlands we have the 'domestic' model...

You have definitely a prewar model (Exxxx), only the late-war/early-postwar models in the O and P Nummernkreise have this asterisk. (Some M models are known to have one too - but that is Zeiss Ikon lore...).

To go into detail about the body numbering scheme takes more than a few pages. Anyway, the earliest Zeiss Ikon letter was Lxxxx, continuing the ICA scheme. After the Z they happily started all over again:-(. With overlaps due to time-related batches, restoring the production numbers of postwar Zeiss Ikon models is a nightmare, or a nice hobby:-)

Hans

[nikonbob]

Hans

Thanks for confirming that is is a pre war camera. I don't envy anyone trying to makes head or tails of their serial numbering system. The best of luck to you.

Bob

[Stephen]

Only a query, is the plaque on the camera definitely a presentation at that date? it might have been the start of a position, and given at the end, or maybe the exact meaning is lost ? The date is only a few days into the war period.
Stephen.

[nikonbob]

Stephen

Now that is a very good point and can't really say for sure one way or the other. The plaque basically says to the person from the company and 17 Sept 1939. Generally when worded like that I believe it was presented on that date. Generally also if it had been presented for a particular length of past service the dates may have been from and to certain dates. Given the date a likely reason might be a going away gift prior to leaving after volunteering for the military. The again the exact meaning would be difficult to determine now and is now indeed lost.

Regardless of the reason for the presentation and apparently the 521/16 was intro-ed in 1938 I think it was quite likely presented on that date.

Bob