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Post by genazzano on Dec 7, 2014 2:01:31 GMT -5
As with the majority of collectors, I spend a significant amount of time scanning Ebay for interesting cameras. One thing I encounter too often is the notice that the seller will not ship to Italy, a major member of the EU. My question is simple: Why is Italy singled out by sellers as the country to which items will not be shipped? I know well the simplistic answers that our post office is unreliable, or buyers frequently do not pay, but what is the real story here? Is there any real data that would substantiate this action and how is it that a seller who participates on an international site can single out one country, a member of the EU, as so unreliable that no shipments will be made. How is it that Ebay can accept this since they operate in the EU and have a specific operation in Ebay.it?
As a serious camera collector who is Italian, living in Italy, I am rather disturbed by this situation. Is there any real data to substantiate refusals to accept bids from Italian buyers? Or, is this a consequence of rumor and blatant discrimination? Or is this topic too hot for our Camera Collector forum?
David
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retina
Senior Member
Posts: 72
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Post by retina on Dec 7, 2014 3:22:25 GMT -5
I doubt this is limited to Italy. Perhaps the sellers in question have been left with a bad taste in their mouths after previous trades. Customs in EU nations are often very enthusiastic in charging import duty on old cameras. Buyers don't like this, naturally enough, and probably vent their anger on the seller for not warning them, or doing anything to limit the damage.
Sellers have to cover themselves against any potential loss from an item going missing in the mail, so anything they sell and ship must be accurately valued, and insured for that value. You can't have one value for insurance and another one for customs purposes, so the declared value will often be higher than the buyer might have liked it to have been.
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Post by genazzano on Dec 7, 2014 3:29:18 GMT -5
Actually, I have never noticed buyers from any other EU state being singled out and blocked from bidding. The seller may clearly have some bad taste left in his mouth, but is it a consequence of real problems, or just a perception, and should this discrimination against buyers in one EU state be permitted under EU fair business practices?
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mickeyobe
Lifetime Member
Resident President
Posts: 7,280
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Post by mickeyobe on Dec 7, 2014 4:04:33 GMT -5
Actually, I have never noticed buyers from any other EU state being singled out and blocked from bidding. The seller may clearly have some bad taste left in his mouth, but is it a consequence of real problems, or just a perception, and should this discrimination against buyers in one EU state be permitted under EU fair business practices? David, Don't feel too badly. We in Canada get this all the time on eBay. Vendor will not ship to Canada. This is very common with US vendors as is their annoying "CONUS". Very well. They just eliminate 10% of their potential sales. It is their loss not ours. I think graduate MBA's using strictly commercial terminology call this "Cutting off one's nose to spite one's face". Mickey |
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Post by genazzano on Dec 7, 2014 4:14:08 GMT -5
"I doubt this is limited to Italy. Perhaps the sellers in question have been left with a bad taste in their mouths after previous trades. Customs in EU nations are often very enthusiastic in charging import duty on old cameras. Buyers don't like this, naturally enough, and probably vent their anger on the seller for not warning them, or doing anything to limit the damage.
Sellers have to cover themselves against any potential loss from an item going missing in the mail, so anything they sell and ship must be accurately valued, and insured for that value. You can't have one value for insurance and another one for customs purposes, so the declared value will often be higher than the buyer might have liked it to have been. "
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One of the problems that discriminatory business practices creates is the fact that when hundreds of thousands of people see that a seller will not ship to Italy (or any other EU state), the immediate inference is made that buyers in that country are seriously unreliable, dishonest, or that insurance rates are higher, or that the country's government routinely seeks unfair costs which burden the seller. None of this has been shown to be true regarding Italy, as far as I know.
Sellers can clearly opt to limit bids to domestic bidders. However, I very much object to the singling out of one EU country and in doing so, lead to some of the inferences that you mention, Chris.
Would it be reasonable for me to offer an item on Ebay but stipulate that Imwould not ship to anyone living in Scotland?
Ciao from Italy!
David
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Stephen
Lifetime Member
Still collecting.......
Posts: 2,718
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Post by Stephen on Dec 7, 2014 10:00:45 GMT -5
The Italian restriction seems on the face of it rather strange, and indeed may be illegal under EU rules. I suspect like Topsy, it grew! and came from reputation, rather than actual problems. In the days before the Euro exchange rates were volatile with the Lira at times, and this may be behind the continuing problems.
Scotland is often missing from offers etc, due to the Islands, Highlands, and Ferry delivery costs, and often a different rate applies on Ebay.
The EU as a whole is not the leveler that they promoted, look at wine and food, it is cheaper and better in Italy than the UK, so you do have compensations!
Stephen.
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mickeyobe
Lifetime Member
Resident President
Posts: 7,280
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Post by mickeyobe on Dec 7, 2014 15:59:32 GMT -5
"Would it be reasonable for me to offer an item on Ebay but stipulate that Imwould not ship to anyone living in Scotland?
Ciao from Italy!
David
Certainly it would be reasonable.
Are you not aware that the Scots are responsible for the near extinction of the wild Haggis?
Mickey
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Post by genazzano on Dec 7, 2014 16:12:15 GMT -5
I think I will accept Mickey's final sage words on this subject and move on. ...on to the EU office on unfair business practices that is.
Ciao from...... Shhhhh, from italy.
David
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Post by philbirch on Feb 24, 2015 21:30:27 GMT -5
David and I successfully conducted a little transaction recently. In my opinion there is nothing wrong with the Italian postal service. I think that people (including myself) read and believe everything they see in print or on t'internet.
I've been getting stuff from Ukraine successfully. If that's anything to go by then Italy should be a piece of cake.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2015 22:22:32 GMT -5
Only place I would absolutely not ship to is Mexico. Mail and packages go missing there often.
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Post by philbirch on Feb 26, 2015 4:28:41 GMT -5
Overall I have had bad experience sending abroad. 5 out of 5 parcels sent to ebay customers have allegedly not got there.
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Post by genazzano on Feb 26, 2015 7:45:02 GMT -5
I mentioned earlier that I have been fortunate. Since 1998 only two items failed to reach me and one was while I was living in California. I have only sold items on ebay a few times and those were a decade ago.
David
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2015 19:47:20 GMT -5
The only bad experience I've had shipping or receiving from overseas was a Zorki 1 that I paid for but never got from a woman in Siberia. That was back in 2002 and I think it was the Siberian bureaucracy rather than the woman. They apparently wouldn't let her ship it because it fell under their antiquities law. She did manage to send my 25 brand new take-up spools and a book on Siberia as partial compensation. I do know that is has been a long time since I've seen any Siberian sellers on Ebay which probably means something.
Over the years I've shipped to the U.K., Sweden, Russia, Israel, Japan and Canada without any problems.
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der84
Senior Member
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Post by der84 on May 14, 2015 11:07:29 GMT -5
There are so many cameras I've missed out on because of the whole will not ship to Canada. I would agree with Mickey when he states that it is the seller's loss. I've been wanting to grab up a few Univex AF cameras for example, but I've been finding that most will not ship to Canada.
The only bad experience I had was last year, I had purchased a VPK off of a seller from England on etsy. When the package arrived it was nothing but an empty unopened envelope with the letter stating that my package had been damaged. I suspected more like stolen during the "in transit" stage.
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