Quite rare Krügener camera

[PeterW]

Hi,

I told myself I wasn't going to buy anything more on eBay for a while, but today I made a low opening bid on a quite rare Krügener folding camera and, to my complete surprise, I won it!

Dr Krügener was making cameras in Frankfurt, Germany, from the 1870s till his company merged with others to form ICA in 1909, so all his cameras are at least 97 years old. The seller was one of the 'don't know anything about cameras' people, and this time I think he was right. The cheapest Krügener camera I've seen for a couple of years or more was about $90, and I won this for £10, about $14.

All the description said was 'condition shows its age but good bellows and everything seems to function'. It didn't even say what size plate or film it takes, and I can't find the exact model listed anywhere. Well, we shall see when it arrives sometime next week.

This time I really will ease up because I also bought John a part for the classsic motorcycle he's restoring and there's only a couple of pounds left in my PayPal account. Powerful deterrent!

Peter

[John Parry]

It makes a change when the seller doesn't know what they've got Peter.

Was having a look at the Ikontas following the recent thread (to see what they are going for at the moment). Came across this:

Item Number - 7610512149
Description - VINTAGE CAMERA BY ZEISS IKON IN A CARRYING/STORAGE CASE

Don't know what you think, but I'm having trouble with that description. It may be a slide copier, but a camera....?

Regards - John

[PeterW]

eBay item 7610512149

It certainly isn't a camera, John. I've never seen one like this before, and I'm far from certain, but I think it may be an episcope or epidiascope for projecting prints and postcards. Zeiss made a huge range of episcopes over the years. Look at that coarse focusing helix on the lens, and no aperture iris. Don't think it's for projecting lantern slides because the two black holders shown in one of the pics have solid backs, like a sheath for cut film. No idea what the wooden frames are for.

Interesting, but not really my field.

Peter

[PeterW]

My Krügener arrived today. Fast posting and well packed.

It was described as a Krügener Periskop Aplanat, but that's the name of the lens. The camera is a Krügener Delta, one of a range he made between about 1900 and 1907. It's in better condition than I thought it was going to be. Just a few places where the leather has broken away from the body, and a couple that need sticking down.

The inside is very good, with a clean lens, good bellows and all the nickel plate bright. The shutter is an early Deckel, 1/25, 1/50 and 1/100, plus B and T, and works happily. There's also a rise and fall front.

It's got a roll film back, but a size I haven't come across before, 10x8cm, or 4x3 1/8 inches. There's one wooden spindled spool, 3 1/2 inches between flanges.

Plate and cut film backs were also available for Deltas, and there are two pointers for the focusing scale. You move a lever marked F and P depending on whether you're using films or plates. There are little individual touches, like the film spool holders have small handles and can be lifted straight out to change films. There is also a pair of long leaf pressure springs to hold the big format backing paper down to the film rails. Cameras were much more individual in those days. I'm very pleased with it.



And here's a 1906 advert for a Krügener Delta a couple of models up-range from mine, with slow speeds and double extension. It's from Deutscher Kamera Almanach for 1906, which I just happened to have on my bookshelf.

And you thought that using a scantily clad young lady to advertise a camera was a new idea!! She's saying 'My best-loved travelling companion is ...'

Peter

[John Parry]

Very nice indeed Peter.

The metalwork looks very nice indeed - no sign of pitting, even on the brass. Now, how are you going to renovate the leather work? Have you considered blue sting-ray, or red lizard?

Only half joking actually - what a conversation piece it would make!! And who's to say what colour it should really be? I'm sure that if those 'edwardian' germans had had the exotic colours available, they would certainly have tried them.

Regards - John

[PeterW]

Thanks, John. But Oh! You wicked old Mancunian Phillistine even to joke about Sting Ray or Red Lizard .

Seriously, I shall have a hunt through my boxes of broken camera bits and pieces, or have a search in the Aladdin's Cave I call my loft for an old box-type document case or something with pebble grain covering and try a few insertion patches, then get busy blending in with black leather dye and wax polish.

However, it's been put on the shelf at the moment because I'm working on a 1906 No 1A Folding Pocket Kodak model D. I'm having to strip out the wooden lens panel and let in a piece of wood where it split because someone obviously tried to close it with the pivoting viewfinder in the wrong position. After an attempted repair (with screws and a panel pin!) the someone painted the panel, and part of the nickel work, a very streaky, gummy gloss black. I've got it sanded off to the bare wood, and though all the pictures I've seen of this model have a black lens panel I might for once break my own rule about originality on antique cameras and refinish it as a slightly red imitation mahogany - it's actually beech or a similar hard wood. I saw a restored example done like this and it looked really good against the red bellows. OK, touché! Who's being a Phillistine now? .

Peter

[herron]

Peter:
I was curious about what type of film your Krügener used, so I queried Central Camera (one of the online sources I know for esoteric film) about it. www.centralcamera.com/films4classics.asp

This was their response to me:

----------
Mr. Herron:
This camera used an 8x10 cm roll film which was never really available in the US. It seems like this camera was more popular in Germany and never really made it here. You could try going to www.filmforclassics.com/ I don't think they will have the film for it but they might be able to give you some more information.

If you have any other questions please return email.

Thank you,
Central Camera Company
----------
I went to Film for Classics, but their web site requests you use email for orders only. If I get a chance, I will fax the inquiry to them in the morning (because now I'm interested in knowing)!

[herron]

peterw said:

....it's been put on the shelf at the moment because I'm working on a 1906 No 1A Folding Pocket Kodak model D. I'm having to strip out the wooden lens panel and let in a piece of wood where it split because someone obviously tried to close it with the pivoting viewfinder in the wrong position. After an attempted repair (with screws and a panel pin!) the someone painted the panel, and part of the nickel work, a very streaky, gummy gloss black. I've got it sanded off to the bare wood, and though all the pictures I've seen of this model have a black lens panel I might for once break my own rule about originality on antique cameras and refinish it as a slightly red imitation mahogany - it's actually beech or a similar hard wood. I saw a restored example done like this and it looked really good against the red bellows. OK, touché! Who's being a Phillistine now? .

Peter

Peter:
Your Kodak sounds like my Kodak Folding Brownie No.2 (c.1904). The lens panel really does look good in red mahogany. Mine is the original finish. I was fortunate in only having to polish the brass a little, clean the viewfinder and refurbish (a little Venetian Black) the outside leather.

 

[PeterW]

Thanks, Ron. The lens panel on your Kodak looks really good. Mine is similar, but the camera's upright format and the viewfinder pivots on the top of the lens panel. I will definitely refinish it in red mahogany now I know that Kodak did on some cameras, and that the restored one I saw wasn't just a one-off.

Thanks also for chasing what film my Krügener used. I don't hold out any hope of getting one but when I've finished refurbishing the body I might see if I can put a cardboard mask in it and adapt a 120 film spool with spacers, but that'll be some time in the future yet.

Peter

[herron]

Peter:
Things got really hectic at work this afternoon, so I never had a chance to follow-up with Film for Classics, to see if they could identify the film your Krügener used! Maybe tomorrow.