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Post by fotobiblios on Jan 23, 2006 16:29:40 GMT -5
Cosina-made (I think) Brauns -- here's the link www.braun-phototechnik.de - name of cameras Braun SR 2000 PK and Braun SR 2000 MD (ie on sale now with Pentax bayonet or Minolta MD mount) and newly announced Braun SR 2000 Contax mount with a slightly different look (squared top like Contax slrs were) and taking Contax slr lenses -- see also the Zeiss website, same place as the announcement of the new Nikon-slr-fit manual focus Zeiss lenses (yes) (possibly also made by Cosina). At least some companies are caring for us classic slr users -- I'd like to buy some product to support them, but I have so much. |
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otthe
Contributing Member
Posts: 43
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Post by otthe on Jan 25, 2006 2:27:42 GMT -5
Hi Gentlemen I just found this board - and this thread really interests me I collect (in addition to Zeiss Ikon and M42 SLRs the house-brand cameras of Photo PORST, at one time the worlds biggest camera dealer (building up from the 1920s and disappearing in the 80s. They "invented" house brand cameras - at least for Germany. because at that time, the cmaera manufacturers were dictating the selling price (like Manufacturers recommended retail Price, but it was not a recommendation but a mandate which could be legally enforced) PORST due to their very high purchasing volume got better prices than the dealer next door - but they could not pass on these savings to end customers because of the law. So they invented house brands - same standard camera but with a different shutter, lens, feature etc - and now they could suddenly decide on their own selling price - and beat the competition. Early on, these housebrand cameras were made by the standard German manufacturers like AGFA, Balda, Braun etc - then came the East Germans (lots of Prakticas) and then - very soon the Japanese - which pretty soon became exclusively Cosina. A lot of detailed descriptions are on my homepage: www.kamera-geschichte.deand the house-brands are listed under www.kamera-geschichte.de/files/alle_kameras_uebersicht_d.htmsorry - only in German - but please use Google to translate. I'll be back, if you wish, with more info regards from Germany Josef |
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Post by Randy on Jan 25, 2006 7:12:59 GMT -5
That's great! Please continue.
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PeterW
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Member has Passed
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Post by PeterW on Jan 25, 2006 7:19:49 GMT -5
Hi Josef, and welcome to the board.
You have a really fascinating website, with so much information. I just spent half an hour browsing through it, although my German is very poor, and I will certainly return to more than once and have parts of it translated. German cameras and the German camera industry, particularly Zeiss Ikon, is one of my favourite subjects.
In the UK we too had Resale Price Maintenance by manufacturers until it was made illegal, and several dealers got round this by having own-brand cameras and equipment, though not on the same scale as Porst.
The largest three were Wallace Heaton with the own brand name Zodel, Westminster Photographic Exchange with Westex, and City Sale and Exchange with Salex. Many of these cameras came from the companies which formed Zeiss Ikon and were dropped from the Zeiss Ikon catalogue during the time in which Zeiss Ikon was rationalising its huge range,
Westminster Photographic Exchange and City Sale and Exchange were bought by Wallace Heaton. This in turn was bought some time in the 1960s or 1970s by the chain store Dixons, then a camera dealer who used the own brand name Prinz. Dixons also used the name Prinz on many Japanese and some Russian cameras. Nowadays, Dixons sells mainly electronic goods with just a few compact digital cameras.
Several smaller camera dealers in the 1930s also had own brand names such as the Sheffield Camera Company which used Norfolk from its address in Norfolk Row, and the Vauxhall Camera Company which, naturally, used the name Vauxhall.
As well as own brand cameras, these dealers also sold cameras with the makers name at full price.
Going back further, in the early 1900s Houghton-Butcher which later became Ensign started by importing cameras from Germany and rebadging them with their own name. The whole of Ilford's Sportsman range of cameras in the 1950s and 1960s came from Dacora in Germany.
Most of the own brand cameras in the UK in the 1930s came from Germany though a few came from Italy and France.
The end of Resale Price Maintenance also saw the end of own brand cameras, and dealers were free to offer any camera at discount prices.
Peter
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Post by lulalake on Jan 25, 2006 20:49:20 GMT -5
Josef,
Thank you so much for your information. I didn't know the Porst camera existed until you posted.
Jules
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Post by herron on Mar 7, 2006 15:14:26 GMT -5
You're right Bud. There was also a Ricoh Singlex based on the Mamiya Prismat. Mamiya rebranded a lot of cameras, starting with their early rangefinders. Usually, it was done to allow large volume retailers, like Sears or Porst (Germany) to sell their cameras below the "base" that they insisted all sellers not go below (a lot of manufacturers did this). Mamiya sold their 528TL rebranded as a Sears Auto35TL and a Porst Autoflex TL. Their 500-TL and 1000-TL were sold as Porst Reflex 500c and Porst Superflex 1000c, respectively. The Mamiya Auto Lux was sold as the Porst Autoflex and the Revere Auto-Lux35 (through Foto-Quelle). And the list goes on and on.....  |
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otthe
Contributing Member
Posts: 43
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Post by otthe on May 7, 2006 13:32:10 GMT -5
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otthe
Contributing Member
Posts: 43
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Post by otthe on May 9, 2006 13:09:22 GMT -5
Bob: By the way, isn't Cosina the company that bought the rights to the Voigtlander name, and now produces those very nice Voigtlander Bessa rangefinders? Thats not quite correct: The Voigtländer company still exists as a legal company, and the own the name Voigtländer. It is owned by the Ringfoto Group. The complete name of that Corporation is: RINGFOTO GmbH & Co. ALFO Marketing KG - Ringfoto is as big German Camera Distribution chain (franchise) - the same company who also owns the Photo PORST name - the company I dedicate most of my collecting to. Ringfoto are using the Voigtländer name for many of their far-east built cameras and lenses; the flagship of the range is the rangefinder series built for them by Cosina. Greetings from Germany Josef www.kamera-geschichte.de |
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Post by herron on May 9, 2006 13:27:59 GMT -5
Bob: By the way, isn't Cosina the company that bought the rights to the Voigtlander name, and now produces those very nice Voigtlander Bessa rangefinders? Thats not quite correct: The Voigtländer company still exists as a legal company, and the own the name Voigtländer. It is owned by the Ringfoto Group. The complete name of that Corporation is: RINGFOTO GmbH & Co. ALFO Marketing KG - Ringfoto is as big German Camera Distribution chain (franchise) - the same company who also owns the Photo PORST name - the company I dedicate most of my collecting to. Ringfoto are using the Voigtländer name for many of their far-east built cameras and lenses; the flagship of the range is the rangefinder series built for them by Cosina. Greetings from Germany Josef www.kamera-geschichte.deJosef: So, how does this correspond to the information here, which says those Voigtlander rangefinders are made by Cosina?  Stephen Gandy is a VERY reliable source! www.cameraquest.com/CosVoigtUser.htm |
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Post by paulatukcamera on May 11, 2006 6:58:21 GMT -5
www.popphoto.com/article.asp?section_id=5&article_id=1990Herbert Keppler's interview with Hirofumi Kobayashi, Cosina's founder(?) & MD. Fills in the background not only to the origins of the use of the Voigtlander name, but also the various connections to other manufacturers. Solves a lot of little mysteries posed in this thread. Paul
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Post by herron on May 11, 2006 8:57:53 GMT -5
Paul: Herbert Kepler's article on the Cosina-made Voigtlander's had another interesting comment in it that I thought was particularly appropriate to the current wild consumer swing into digital imaging: "Are we now passionless? Pretty much so, I think. Did we ever have it? Yes—once, opening a box containing a new camera and showing it off to our friends with awe was almost an act of worship. With today's digital SLRs, we'd probably tear open the box and get the camera working. We're just too practical to get passionate over a camera. Too bad. It made us feel good. I hope at least we can still be passionate about shooting pictures."I think it's fairly true to say that a lot of the picture-taking public is pretty unemotional about cameras and photography. We live in such a visually oriented world anymore, there is a tendency to take it all for granted. H-m-m-m-m.....sounds like a whole new thread idea!  I think I'll duplicate this as a new thread and see where it goes! |
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cmc850
Contributing Member
Charles Cihon
Posts: 33
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Post by cmc850 on May 11, 2006 9:51:55 GMT -5
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Post by herron on May 11, 2006 12:13:30 GMT -5
I stopped in to my local camera store and found them selling just a few film slrs.....plus some I hadn't seen before. They have "house brand" (Promaster) manual K-mount slrs intended, I think, for the student market. Wonder if Cosina is responsible for these, too? Charles: This is from that same Keppler article in PopPhoto: "....Kobayashi has gained something of a triumph with his 19–35mm f/3.5–4.5 lens, sold under the Phoenix, Promaster, Ritz Quantaray, Tokina, Tamron, and Vivitar labels, all at the same time...."If Cosina is making lenses for them, how separate is the making of the camera body? |
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jack
Senior Member
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Post by jack on Jun 8, 2006 19:43:19 GMT -5
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Post by vintageslrs on Jun 8, 2006 23:38:41 GMT -5
Jack
thanks for the link and for posting.....
but from the photo....I don't think it's a Cosina.....
I could be wrong....but I think perhaps this SLR was badged by Chinon but really made by Mamiya for Chinon, who then sold a number of them to Revue........
Perhaps Ron Herron could shed some light on this.....
Bob
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Stephen Gandy is a VERY reliable source! 
I think I'll duplicate this as a new thread and see where it goes! 
