Comparison

[jennyandernie]

We could have called this thread "Which does the collector think is the more desirable camera" ; but that is a bit long winded.

We took a couple of rangefinders out the other day to test them; a Minolta Hi-matic 9 and a Voigtlander Vito CLR. Ernie had one and I had the other and we more or less shot the same scenes; most of them around Bury St Edmunds Cathedral.

After we had developed the films it was obvious that the Minolta had a much sharper lens than the Voigtlander but although both cameras are in good condition the Voigtlander is in mint condition. It not only has an almost new case it has the instruction book, original box and the little white incident light screen which clips on to the selenium cell (which is nearly always missing).

So which does the collector value the most? Both give good results but one does have a sharper lens and hence better photos; the other is a camera in complete as purchased condition.

We have posted three photos taken with the cameras below. The first two with the Minolta the third with the Voigtlander; the difference in sharpness in not so obvious in these as they have been "saved for web".

Jenny and Ernie.

[Just Plain Curt]

I'm biased:



Vito B




Vito BL




Vito C



Vito CL



Vito Automatic 1

As well as 2 Brilliants, a Vito, and several Bessas including RF.

The Minolta while using a better lens is relatively plain to look at and not that scarce whereas the Voigtlander is seen less often. At least in this neck of the woods. By the way, I like the pictures from both equally well.

[PeterW]

Nice collection of Vitos, Curt.

Strangely, for me Vitos never held any attraction, at least not the all-enveloping rigid body ones like these. I had one once, but didn't like the sliding shutter release on the front so I sold it after the first film. I like the look of the folding Vito, particularly the pre-war version, but never got around to owning one.

I've got several 1930s Voigtländers, and they're nice cameras, but none of them tug at me like the 1930s Zeiss Ikons do.

But then it wouldn't do for anyone to be guided by an idiosyncratic daft old b****r like me! .

PeterW

[jennyandernie]

We have a Vito I



A small easy camera to use the film is wound on by a knob on the top plate and the shutter cocked on the lens and fired by lever on the door. The shutter speeds are set on a lens ring. The lens is a Skopar 50mm f3.5 and the Commpur Rapid shutter speeds are from 1sec to 1/500sec.

On the model we have there is no wind on stop and the only way to tell when you have wound on to the next frame is by looking at the small film counter. Most Voigtlander Vito cameras will not allow you to wind on and fire the shutter without a film loaded; this one will ? Another interesting feature is that the spool the film is wound on to is removable. The camera is very similar to many roll film folders in style.

[PeterW]

That's the one Ernie, except if memory serves me the one I nearly bought some time ago had a built-in hinged yellow filter on the front of the 3.5 Skopar lens and a 1 to 1/300 Compur. Maybe a slightly earlier version?

I thought it would look rather nice keeping company with my collection of 1930s Retinas (sincerest form of flattery?), but at the time I had to choose between the Vito and a relatively rare Retina I Type 118 (only 9,144 made according to Brian Coe). I'd already bought three cameras at that camera fair and hadn't got enough money left for both, so I chose the Retina.

Never mind, like buses another will come along eventually.

BTW, I know I mentioned my fondness for 1930s Zeiss Ikon products, but I've always regarded the early Retinas, designed by ex-Zeiss Ikon designer Dr. August Nagel, as cameras that Zeiss Ikon should have made if Nagel had stayed with them. They equal them in quality, and from a short distance away they even look like Z-I products with their angular chopped-off corners.

PeterW

[nikonbob]

For a rabid collector the answer is simple, the camera that is rarer and in the best cosmetic condition. I don't think the ablity to take a sharper photo than another camera even enters into the equation. I do have a Minolta Hi Matic E with the same lens and was very impressed with the sharpness of that lens. As an image taker it is hard to beat for the price.

Bob

[herron]

I think I more or less agree with Bob.

A collector seems to be one who is looking for the cosmetically perfect specimen. Whether it works or not is sometimes secondary, because the collector just collects...he/she doesn't necessarily use.

A user on the other hand, may purchase a camera that is less than cosmetically nice, but which works extremely well, because he/she intends to use them, not sit them in a barrister case and look them.

IMHO a much more infrequent combination is the collector/user . . . and I think there are a lot of that rare breed here!

[kamera]

The pics are most beautiful!!! You seem to live in an area great for photgenic material and lovely buildings.

In the Minolta Himatic line I only have an F model. Pics from it are not bad except for backlit ones.

I have a Voigtlander Vito II which is great quality and much fun to use.

Trouble is, once one has accumulated so many cameras they like to use...one does not have the time to dedicate to each.

At times I have thought it would be better to just 'collect' representative cameras that are cosmetically good but mechanically defunct...that would solve the problem of which to use when.

Ron Head
Kalamazoo, MI

[chrisy]

8-)Hi j&e,I always find comparisons a little tricky like choosing between ones children.The pics are excellent so no problem there;as I own a CLR and a Hi-Matic 7 myself and given the choice I would take the CLR as its a little smaller (only the straps broken on the case!) and quieter in use. However I think of myself more as a 'user' than as a 'collector' so that may account for my choice. So where's that church then...........

[jennyandernie]

Thanks for the kind comments. The church is Bury St Edmunds Cathedral which has just had the tower restored. In the second photo the Cathedral is framed in the ruins of the old abbey.

Ron, we live in an area which although not a place of outstanding geographic features abound with quaint old thatched cottages and villages with old churches and half timbered buildings going back to the Middle Ages. In fact I don't think there is a thatched cottage within 50 miles we have not photographed lol.

Jenny