Agfa Memo

[Stephen]

I bid and bought an Agfa Ansco Memo,.... no other bids, which shows how little known these are in the UK generally. Coming with original case as well, with cut out for the wind on tab on the back of the camera.

I assumed I had aside a couple of Agfa Rapid cassettes, which fit the Memo as well as the Ansco original Memo cassettes, but find the Karat on display in the cupboard is empty, no cassettes, I expect they are around somewhere.
I expect, indeed hope they turn up, as I have just seen the prices on EBay for rapid cassettes.....Ouch!

It may be cheaper to buy a cheap Rapid camera with cassettes than buy a single one! Have to search the Ebay German site as well.

I paid just a pound less than the original dollar price in the advert for the US made camera. I notice all the advertising refers to a "double frame camera", meaning twice movie format, 24x36 standard. Ansco introduced a rarer half frame 18x24mm version in 1941, after the wartime enforced split with Agfa in Germany. Agfa of course had their own Karat camera which also took the Rapid cassettes, but like the Rapid cameras cannot take the Memo cassette, only the Agfa Ansco Memo can take both types of film cassette.

Stephen.

[Doug T.]

Hi Stephen!

I've been looking for some Rapid cartridges as well, and believe that you're right about finding them. It's possible to find 60's era Agfa Rapid cameras still in the box, with film, for less than the cartridges themselves cost!
For quite a while now I've been searching locally for anything Ansco. It's not as easy as I thought it would be.

Doug

[Stephen]

The Memo that is coming is the "De-luxe" version as although I can't see on the Ebay shot, the exact lens, it has the rangefinder shoe on the top plate, which the base model omitted, and the base model was painted, not leather covered.
There appear to have been a basic, a middle and a top version.

To add to the search for Agfa Rapid cassettes, I have also bought from a local junk shop a 1938 or thereabouts, Agfa Karat, in need of some TLC, but working shutter, thank goodness.

Not a sniff of any spare Rapid cassette in it though!!

35 mm Kodak can be used in modified standard cassettes, shortened in height a bit, and with the spool cropped short, I expect that the Memo could take 355 cassettes more easily than the Rapid.

I am told that the spools from the disposable cameras fit, but I have not got one to try out, I wonder if the APS film would drop into the Memo? (..with no spool fitted).

Other that that it's tin snips out, and cut out, and solder up a couple of replacements in the workshop. I have no dimensions, but they could be estimated from the Agfa Karat film chamber.

Stephen.

[Stephen]

Err.... , one US seller has a Rapid Cassette, reasonable on Buy it Now, but $38 postage, I'll give it a by!

[Doug T.]

Stephen,

There's one for ca. 11 USD with 3.77 shipping here in the US. Is that it?
If so, I would guess the shipping to the UK to be 10 or less.

Doug

[Stephen]

Call me a cheapskate, but I will wait, I am keeping an eye on an old Rapid with two cassettes, and I am sure the two I have somewhere will show up soon....guaranteed to show just after I have bought a pair of expensive ones!!

Stephen.

[julio1fer]

I did not know that the Rapid cassette was a pre-war invention. So Agfa rediscovered it in the 60's ? Or was the Memo cassette a different animal?

[Stephen]

Jul 25, 2013 18:35:51 GMT -5 julio1fer said:

I did not know that the Rapid cassette was a pre-war invention. So Agfa rediscovered it in the 60's ? Or was the Memo cassette a different animal?

Top is Memo, bottom is Karat (Rapid is the same, with minor changes.)



The Rapid added a tab to tell the camera the ISO film speed, it also held the cassette more firmly, but they fit Karat and Memo the same. The light trap was better, but the re-use of the cassette risked dirt getting into the trap and scratching new film. Agfa insisted that the trap was to be cleaned with compressed air before re-use.

---

The Memo film cassette was first, coming in the 1920's from Ansco, in answer to the Kodak patents on the 35mm cassette. They could not patent 35mm sprocketed or plain film, it was too widely used, but you could use the film loose, with a backing paper,(828 and Bolta), or invent your own cassette.

The Memo camera used an unusual transport, no sprockets, but a pull along claw to move the film forward on each film in one stroke. The Memo cartridges had loose sprocketed film inside, and delivered the film to an empty cartridge, which was then taken to be processed.

Agfa and Ansco amalgamated in the late 20's, but designs remained separate, and the Germans came up with the more sophisticated Karat cassette for Europe in the Mid 1930's.

Ansco's Memo took both cassettes, but the Karat cameras cannot take Memo, there was no need, as Memo film was not sold in Germany. An odd restriction on Karat was that the Karat cassette remained the property of Agfa, each was returned in turn for processing and re-use.

Both Memo and Karat had lower limits on frame numbers despite no centre spool, and risked scratches a bit with large lengths of film. The film remained flatter in the film pane due to the straight film passage through the camera.

The Germans stopped the Karat production after the war, the Kodak Cassette had taken over, but some makers continued with the Karat cartridges, including the USSR with the SL cassette. Ansco supplied Memo film for a while after the war, in the States, but no new post war cameras.

As soon as the Kodak Instamatic was announced, then Agfa, now independent from Ansco, dusted off the old Karat design, and altered it to the Rapid system, same basics, new better light trap, and a new support tab for the cassette, and more film inside.

The Rapid film is backwards compatible with Karat, and fits Ansco Memo as well. It finally faded in the late 1970's under the onslaught of 110 and disc film.

Given empty cassettes, it remains a usable system with off loaded film from 35mm cassettes.

Stephen.

[julio1fer]

Interesting, Stephen! thanks for this explanation. I was only aware of the Rapid-Instamatic wars back in the 1960s. And of course the Karat patronen, my father had a Karat when I was a child.

[Stephen]

I have now got the Agfa Ansco Memo, in good condition, but needs a clean and polish, the shutter works, lens clean, and leather intact, with a very nice leather case, which may be have been supplied by Agfa from Germany, as it is very high quality leather. Most US cases were different materials or leather types.

The only issue so far was the winder sliding tab on the back was jammed at one end, but it eased with a spot of oil, and works correctly now, a very nice wind on system. The film counter works as well.

I have some Rapid cassettes now, I wondered if original empty Memo cassettes turn up on US ebay?

I'll post some shots as soon as cleaned up and tested a bit more.

Stephen.

[Stephen]

On the Memo cassettes, there appears to be a spot of mystery, Ansco Memo date from the late 20's, but there are references on the net to Agfa Memo German cameras of half frame size, made in Germany in this late20's , early 30's period, earlier than the later Karat or Rapid system.

Was this just an instance of Agfa in Germany making a camera to take the US Ansco Memo film, or has somebody got the information a bit wrong?

Stephen.

[Stephen]

I may have found the answer to the mystery half frame "Agfa Memo" of 1927, it is in fact a normal half frame US made Ansco, with a wooden body, but Ansco supplied a lot with Agfa Lenses and shutters, before the official tie up with Agfa Ansco working together. Apparently a whole range of lens were fitted to these early type Memo cameras. Ansco referred to the cameras as full frame, meaning a full cinema frame, which is half frame today. There talk of full frame as "double frame" cameras.

I think somebody assumed as Agfa was prominent on the front, it was made by Agfa, when in fact a US Ansco production.

Stephen.

[Stephen]

After cleaning up, a problem, the shutter runs and operated correctly, till "T" was tried, and it has locked the bldes open, no amount or re-setting etc will shift them, the clockwork is OK, it behaves as if the blades on there own are jammed or still latched in the T position, so a strip will be needed into the Wollensak Shutter.
Every thing else works and the F3.5 lens is clear and focuses correctly on a ground glass. The parts are very well made, and finished in nickel plate etc.
It expect the problem with the blades is lack of use, stuck in open,and just need cleaning. The timing clockwork is working OK despite the blades not moving, so they must be sprung against the movement of the clockwork, and when they jam it does not hinder the clockwork, unlike a Compur style shutter.
Stephen

[Doug T.]

I hope that this doesn't come across as a stupid question, but did you press the shutter release a second time?

Doug

[Stephen]

A second press, and many more, in every combination, even easing the speed ring whilst the shutter is cocked, in the hope the blades would close, but nothing so far, the clockwork timing operates, it is just the clockwork has opened the blades, and left them open, as the rest works, I can only assume Wollensak sprung the blades closed, and a jam is just holding them at the moment. the lens is absolutely clean, but dust may have got in etc, or maybe Wollensak lubricated the blade pivots, and it has dried up.

I am assuming the shutter is less sophisticated than a German Compur, where such a jam would stop the shutter dead.
If it has to come apart, I will have to photograph all the parts and stages in taking it apart.

The seller admitted the camera was his fathers and long stored away, so it's not completely unexpected. I am busy on other cameras so will try it again after warming up the lot etc, and see if it just comes back to life on it's own first.

Stephen.